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Month 3, Day 17, 5 ABY, 12:15 AM

Military Personnel Discussion


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#1
K.H.

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Thanks to the brilliant programming work of ol' Bregor, we have the infrastructure to do some really interesting things when it comes to tying technologies to personnel. Before I get started on this next phase of restart work, I would like to see what direction the player base wanted to go.

 

The Simple Plan: The simple plan will expedite the restart process and involve a few technologies (military training doctrine really, under the technology doctrine).

 

Basic Personnel:

Allows Construction of: Basic Training Facility

Basic Training Facility: Allows construction of: Professional Soldier, Partisans.

Allows research of Intermediate Personnel Technology

 

Intermediate Personnel:

Allows Construction of: Intermediate Training Facility 

Intermediate Training Facility: Allows construction of: Professional Naval Personnel, Professional Pilots, Professional Soldier, Reserve Infantry, Partisans

Allows research of Advanced Personnel Technology

 

Advanced Personnel:

Allows Construction of: Advanced Training Facility

Advanced Training Facility: Allows Construction of more personnel units than the Intermediate Training Facility.

Allows research of Elite Personnel Technology

 

Elite Personnel Technology

Allows Construction of: Elite Training Facility

Elite Training Facility: Allows construction of Elite Soldier, Elite Pilots, Elite Naval Personnel 

 

Suggested Prices:

Basic Personnel: All planets will start with this technology

Basic Training Facility: 10,000 credits

Intermediate Personnel: 25,000 credits

Intermediate Training Facility: 20,000 credits

Advanced Personnel: 40,000 credits

Advanced Training Facility: 40,0000

Elite Technology: 100,000 credits

Elite Training Facility: 30,000 credits

 

Capacity:

BTF: 1000 personnel a month

ITF: 2000 personnel a month

ATF: 5000 personnel a month

ETF: 200 personnel a month

 

Upkeep:

BTF: 2000 credits

ITF: 4000 credits

ATF: 10,000 credits

ETF: 2,000 credits

 

I just threw these figures out here, so if somebody has a better suggestion, I will be glad to discuss it.

 

Next, the Complicated Plan:

 

 



#2
Xaph

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Can't wait to beta test this new system!



#3
K.H.

K.H.

The Complicated Plan: Restart longer, will help with game balance, will make game more difficult to pick up but more rewarding.

 

Tech Category Ground Infantry

 

Technologies

Basic Terrestrial Warfare 

Intermediate Terrestrial Warfare

Advanced Terrestrial Warfare

New Republic Doctrine

Imperial Doctrine

Elite Terrestrial Warfare

Special Elite Training (Given to Mandalore, Kashyyyk, Rodia, Trandosha, etc)

Infantry Conscription

 

Category: Combined Arms

Vehicle Training

Orbital Insertion 

Combat Engineering

 

Category: Pilot Training

 

Basic Flight Training

Advanced Flight Training

Elite Flight Training

New Republic Flight Training

Imperial Flight Training

 

Category: Space Warfare

Basic Naval Training

Advanced Naval Training

Elite Naval Training

Naval Conscription

Marines

 

Category: Asymmetrical Warfare

 

Basic Asymmetrical 

Advanced Asymmetrical

Elite Asymmetrical 

 

Allows:

 

Basic Terrestrial Warfare- Basic Training Facility

Intermediate Terrestrial Warfare - Intermediate Training Facility

Advanced Terrestrial Warfare - Advanced Training Facility

New Republic Doctrine - New Republic Training Facility

Imperial Doctrine - Imperial Training Facility

Elite Terrestrial Warfare - Elite Training Facility

Special Elite Training - Special Training Facility

Infantry Conscription -Conscript Training Facility

 

Vehicle Training- Allows use of military vehicles (Walkers, Scout Vehicles, Tanks, etc)

Orbital Insertion - Orbital Insertion School

Combat Engineering- Combat Engineer School

 

Basic Asymmetrical: Privateer Den, Smuggler Ring, Terrorist Organization, 

Advanced Asymmetrical: Mercenary Company, Bounty Hunter GuildSlicer School, Mercenary Company, 

Elite Asymmetrical: Large Mercenary Company, Sleeper Cell School

 

Facilities:

 

Basic Training Facility: Professional Infantry

Intermediate Training Facility: More Professional Infantry

Advanced Training Facility: More Professional Infantry

New Republic Training Facility: New Republic Infantry

Imperial Training Facility: Storm Trooper

Elite Training Facility: Elite Personnel

Special Training Facility: Special Personnel (planet dependent)

Conscript Training Facility: Conscript Infantry

Orbital Insertion School: Orbital Commando

Combat Engineer School: Combat Engineer

 

Basic Flight School: Professional Pilot

Advanced Pilot School: More Professional Pilots

Elite Pilot School: Elite Pilot

New Republic Pilot School: Professional Pilot (Discounted upkeep)

Imperial Pilot School: Professional Pilot (Discounted upkeep)

 

Basic Naval Training School: Professional Naval Personnel

Advanced Naval Training School: More Professional Naval Personnel

Elite Naval Training School: Elite Naval Personnel

Conscript Training School: Naval Conscript

Marine Training School: Space Marine

 

Privateer Den: Privateer

Smuggler Ring: Smuggler

Terrorist Organization: Terrorist

Bounty Hunter Guild: Bounty Hunter

Mercenary Company: Mercenary

Slicer School: Slicer 

Large Mercenary Company: More Mercenaries

Sleeper Cell School: Sleeper Agent

 

Costs for technologies and individual units are to be decided, but resemble the basic plan. 

Basic Flight School: Professional Pilot

Advanced Pilot School: More Professional Pilots

Elite Pilot School: Elite Pilot

New Republic Pilot School: Professional Pilot (Discounted upkeep)

Imperial Pilot School: Professional Pilot (Discounted upkeep)

 


#4
Daedalus

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I like the "complicated" one.

 

It took me a few read throughs to digest it, but I think that's more to do with how its written out than the system itself.

 

One question though:

 

Are the Basic, Intermediate and Advanced Doctrines etc going to be quantified?

 

The reason I ask is that it doesn't take a advanced doctrine and staff college to be able to put rounds down range in a semi-respectable grouping. What I would see as the real points of difference will be with a: manoeuvre and b: log support (though I'm yet to see even an advanced military get log right).



#5
K.H.

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They basically determine how large of a facility you can build. So the number of personnel you can train at one time. 

 

So if you have advanced, you can build a larger facility that can train more people.  



#6
Xaph

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Hey, KH, could you give us a random example of a planet's population in comparison to it's military? like i don't know, oh, mandalore maybe? :P



#7
Potestas

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How will this work for a caste system like Geonosis where Elite units are born rather than trained?
Would they just receive better stats?

Example: Geo Pilots are paired with a flight computer at birth. They also possess hightened reflexes and the ability to focus during the spins the Nantex fighter can perform. Would this show up in their flight stats?
"Man plans, God laughs."

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We are those people. If history only remembers one in a thousand of us, then the future will be filled with stories of who we were and what we did. But until that day comes, we will stand. We will look death in the eye and we will fight."

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#8
Bregor

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I don't necessarily see a need to simulate the whole canon process there - I would just make it a Geonosis-specific training facility with low capacity, able to train a unique pilot unit. Since a round is rarely more than 10-20 years, it's not like any change to birth policy will have time do anything in-game.

 

Besides limiting industry and unit types, you could also imagine the sum of your military advancements replacing the abstract 0-100 number for military levels when it comes to determining battle outcome. Those levels in arctic warfare won't help much on Tatooine.



#9
K.H.

K.H.

Hey, KH, could you give us a random example of a planet's population in comparison to it's military? like i don't know, oh, mandalore maybe? :P

 

Mandalore would probably start out with a Special Training Facility and a Bounty Hunter Guild. The Special Infantry Unit is a blanket term for any planet that has a special unit. 


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#10
K.H.

K.H.

How will this work for a caste system like Geonosis where Elite units are born rather than trained?
Would they just receive better stats?

Example: Geo Pilots are paired with a flight computer at birth. They also possess hightened reflexes and the ability to focus during the spins the Nantex fighter can perform. Would this show up in their flight stats?

 

Geonosis would probably start out with a advanced pilot school or something, it was playable this round. 



#11
Amorn

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The only problem is that in Star Wars you get entire species within whom war is effectively a "way of life" and as such you don't really need a centralised military training academy, then you also get clone/droid armies and then of course the slave hordes of say the Hutts. Like if your an aggressive slaving state why train anyone? You can just launch slave raiders and then bring in captured professionals to serve the roles you need.



#12
K.H.

K.H.

We want to be able to automate the process. The old way was to send an action recruiting personnel. Then some military avatar would take time out of his day to decide how many troops the action deserved, then add those units to the player page. This takes out the avatar middle man. The player just tells his facility to recruit people and it recruits people and adds them to his inventory. 



#13
Bregor

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I don't see why the Hutt couldn't use military actions to capture slave soldiers, even with this system in place. Clones/droids are simulated quite well by a factory system as well. Note that a unit in the industry system doesn't necessarily represent one building doing one thing - it is just an abstraction. You can simulate the effective personnel output of a planet-wide network of nomad clans with one industrial unit if that has the right flavor for you.



#14
Xaph

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Any numbers on Mandalore?



#15
K.H.

K.H.

All of the industries and units have been put in game for the "complicated plan" which so far hasn't been that complicated. Now we just need to work some bugs out of the tech trees and hand them out to the planets. 



#16
WitchDoktor

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The big issue I see is that most people could train elite troops, which means almost everyone would have an elite facility. So it begs the question why have the facility if you just have to hand it out to 80% of planets?

Round 6: Telos IV
Round 7: Ralltiir
Round 8: Sluis Van
Round X: Chiss Ascendancy, Sub Avatar
Round 11: Head Military Avatar, Skako
Round 12: Head Military Avatar, Head GPOL Avatar - Awards: Most User-Friendly Avatar, Best Overall Avatar, BH's 'Member of the Round' Award
Round 13: Neimoidia/Viceroy/HoS-CIS/Restart Team/Sub-Avatar - Awards: Best Arms Market
Round 14: Chiss Ascendancy, LOA
Round 15: Chief of Staff
Round 16: Corellia
Round 17: Chiss Ascendancy
Round 18: Induparan Crown Worlds/Coruscant - Awards: Most Politically Successful, Most Militarily Successful, Best Overall Player
Round 19: Ciutric Sector
Round 20: Seswenna Sector
Round 21: Mandalore, Eriadu Union State
Round 22/23: Head Avatar, Security Ops/Policy Avatar, Advisor, Senex-Juvex/Combined Syndicates/Ravnican Empire - Awards: Most Military Successful Player, Best MILI Action, Tekaryn Award for Multiple Personalities.

Round 24: Allied Tion/United Kingdoms of Tion

Round 25: Admiral Ackbar/Alliance Fleet

Round 26: Night Hammer Command/Imperial High Commander/Moff Tarkin - Awards: Best Arms Market, Villain of the Round

 


#17
WitchDoktor

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Geonosis would probably start out with a advanced pilot school or something, it was playable this round.

Geonosis would start out with nothing because they're all dead lol

Round 6: Telos IV
Round 7: Ralltiir
Round 8: Sluis Van
Round X: Chiss Ascendancy, Sub Avatar
Round 11: Head Military Avatar, Skako
Round 12: Head Military Avatar, Head GPOL Avatar - Awards: Most User-Friendly Avatar, Best Overall Avatar, BH's 'Member of the Round' Award
Round 13: Neimoidia/Viceroy/HoS-CIS/Restart Team/Sub-Avatar - Awards: Best Arms Market
Round 14: Chiss Ascendancy, LOA
Round 15: Chief of Staff
Round 16: Corellia
Round 17: Chiss Ascendancy
Round 18: Induparan Crown Worlds/Coruscant - Awards: Most Politically Successful, Most Militarily Successful, Best Overall Player
Round 19: Ciutric Sector
Round 20: Seswenna Sector
Round 21: Mandalore, Eriadu Union State
Round 22/23: Head Avatar, Security Ops/Policy Avatar, Advisor, Senex-Juvex/Combined Syndicates/Ravnican Empire - Awards: Most Military Successful Player, Best MILI Action, Tekaryn Award for Multiple Personalities.

Round 24: Allied Tion/United Kingdoms of Tion

Round 25: Admiral Ackbar/Alliance Fleet

Round 26: Night Hammer Command/Imperial High Commander/Moff Tarkin - Awards: Best Arms Market, Villain of the Round

 


#18
Daedalus

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They basically determine how large of a facility you can build. So the number of personnel you can train at one time. 
 
So if you have advanced, you can build a larger facility that can train more people.


Ahh good. I definitely vote for the complicated version then.

#19
K.H.

K.H.

The big issue I see is that most people could train elite troops, which means almost everyone would have an elite facility. So it begs the question why have the facility if you just have to hand it out to 80% of planets?

 

So it is automated. Otherwise you would need to send in an action which takes up the avatar's time and would have an arbitrary completion time. With the facility, the player can recruit and train troops all by himself. 



#20
Romae

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Will we be able to build multiples of these facilities: If I need 50,000 men to man an ISD and my faciliies dictate 1,000 naval personnel a month..that math doesn't work. If I can invest, I can build another 9 of these facilities and can man the ISD in 5 months instead of 50 months.

 

Also, I assume this won't change the nature of military training actions (building better academies and training systems to get high personnel levels)? Or are those levels kaput?






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